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Post by depluto on Dec 14, 2004 0:04:13 GMT -5
After reading a few Broadway comics for the first time. I noticed something. Two things actually.
Shooter must really dig chicks with big nards, eh?
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Post by knightt on Dec 14, 2004 0:34:39 GMT -5
Hell yeah... who doesnt ? Well it started out as a joke for the times as chicks with big knockers was selling books. Look at Fatale... I mean, all I see is the boobies.
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Post by Defiant1 on Dec 14, 2004 2:36:44 GMT -5
"Nards"? Where does that word originate? I've heard it used as a substitute for "nads", but not anything female related.
Bad Girl books were it in 1996. I just saw Perg #6 (1st Hellina) on Rocket2600's Lightning Comics cover gallery. It brought back memories. Characters like Hellina and Lady Death triggered the bad girl phase. I was doing shows occassionally back then and I made a killing selling Vampirella, Razor, and others. I was usually sold out just as the craze hit it's peak. By the time anyone else was even displaying it, I was displaying the next hot item. I bought the original Strangers in Paradise #1-3 off of a guy just as others were starting to display Razor. Fatale, like Valiant was gaining it's following slowly. People were realizing there was more to it than healthy lungs. Fatale was like a spring being compressed. It was about to be the next big thing and it had quality to back up the hype. Most "bad girl" books back then didn't. The problem with running a company and looking at numbers is that you have no perspective about what the numbers are telling you. On paper, Fatale looked like a failure, but to sit in the stores and listen to the chatter at the time... a lot of people were starting to take notice and starting to look for the back issues. It was starting to sell out and selling out was the trigger that catpulted any comic into being a super hot book. Collectors react to a sold out comic the way they do to a long line at the public restroom. They don't care what it takes to be next in line to their goal....even if they have to knock over everyone in their way to get there. It's the stupid panic reactions that some people have that makes others buy into the hype. When I was selling comics it was like giving a drug addict their fix.
Defiant1
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Post by knightt on Dec 14, 2004 12:50:22 GMT -5
I agree that Fatale has some solid reading material (and yes boobies are nice also)... but I think that perhaps Shooter was considered such a pariah for the comics industrty that it stunted the growth of his comic line(s). Sure, he started BIG with Valiant but the OUSTING that he got just had to stick with him and people were letting their hand stray mere centimeters from the book, getting just ready to buy it when their apprehension kicked in. And that is too bad as his writing style and way of seeing the world is just amazing (TILTED in a good writing sense but none the less amazing). Jim has sent me a couple screen treatments (and promised MORE - for Jim if he is reading this ;D) and they are a bit disturbing and I think THAT is what sold both Valiant and Defiant books. The taboo stuff that people dont talk about... I like that style but not everyone thinks as I do.
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Post by depluto on Dec 14, 2004 14:16:51 GMT -5
"Nards"? Where does that word originate? I've heard it used as a substitute for "nads", but not anything female related. "Nards" was an old word from college way back. I guess its been "urbanized" to mean something entirely different. I guess I should have used "funbags." ;D |
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Post by knightt on Dec 14, 2004 14:24:53 GMT -5
fun pillows pillows of love BAMs (big ass mammories) hooters titties heavy hangers juggs boobies boobs ok ok... I digress, BACK ON TOPIC MEN !!!  |
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Post by Defiant1 on Dec 14, 2004 14:39:56 GMT -5
I agree that Fatale has some solid reading material (and yes boobies are nice also)... but I think that perhaps Shooter was considered such a pariah for the comics industrty that it stunted the growth of his comic line(s). Sure, he started BIG with Valiant but the OUSTING that he got just had to stick with him and people were letting their hand stray mere centimeters from the book, getting just ready to buy it when their apprehension kicked in. And that is too bad as his writing style and way of seeing the world is just amazing (TILTED in a good writing sense but none the less amazing). Jim has sent me a couple screen treatments (and promised MORE - for Jim if he is reading this ;D) and they are a bit disturbing and I think THAT is what sold both Valiant and Defiant books. The taboo stuff that people dont talk about... I like that style but not everyone thinks as I do. Jim's biggest publicity problem is that hundreds of thousands of people picked up Valiant because his writing was praised and they could only afford the comics he didn't write. His name is associated with the garbage he didn't write. Jim's 2nd biggest problem is that he hasn't been able to finish anything in the past ten years. The Fatale TPB is pretty much it since Unity. His finished works get the greatest praise. Jim's 3rd dilemma is that he writes epics that build evolve. Simple minded readers want instant gratification. You have to beat them over the head to jump on board. Once you get them and lure them along and they "get it".....they're sold... but that takes a certain critical mass. Fatale had a good formula. It fed the shallow and the educated. You have to reach a wide range of demographics. There is no way around that. The music industry does it all the time. White artist sing R&B. Metal artists sing Rap music. It's all about cross-marketing. You keep an audience that is receptive and you throw a few twist to appeal to completely different audiences that might be receptive. When I first bought some art from Janet, I gave her my take on how to regenerate an audience. She probably forgot. None of it's easy, but I'm confident that another Valiant could be started from the ground up with even smaller roots. It would take a lot of writing skill, but I think it could happen and I know he has it. The problem these days is that there is no money in running a buisness. The only money is from starting one and selling it. With that in mind, it doesn't matter what he does. Whether he slaves for someone else or for himself, it's still a base level commitment that takes a full relentless effort. Defiant1 |
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Post by knightt on Dec 14, 2004 14:51:33 GMT -5
Agreed...
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Post by depluto on Dec 14, 2004 16:29:24 GMT -5
Is Shooter ever going to be up for that sort of thing again?
I would imagine something like that would take a total rededication of your life. He's already tried it a few times, why try again?
Not that I wouldn't like to see it happen.
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Post by knightt on Dec 14, 2004 16:54:16 GMT -5
I have asked Jim in a few emails and he just said that 'no, not really in the cards at the moment'. A pity, I say... as I am very eager to see what he would be coming up with these days. But the way that books are written today, I dont know if there would be a market for it. At least there would be a market coming from THIS website, that I am pretty sure of.
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Post by Defiant1 on Dec 14, 2004 19:36:08 GMT -5
I have asked Jim in a few emails and he just said that 'no, not really in the cards at the moment'. A pity, I say... as I am very eager to see what he would be coming up with these days. But the way that books are written today, I dont know if there would be a market for it. At least there would be a market coming from THIS website, that I am pretty sure of. This web site was better suited as a billboard, not a showcase for Jim's writing. Anybody can or could put one up. Mr. Shooter is responsible for me staying with comics once I came back in 1991. I had a full 6 year hiatus prior to that and I bought absolutely nothing between about 1984 and 1996. Jim Shooter produces a product that is both needed and absent in the market. My hit and miss purchases now will hardly qualify me as a new comics buyer. My subscriptions ended right after Unity 2K #3 was cancelled. I just got tired of following shallow comics with no direction. The buisness model Jim wants to materialize is probably not in the cards. That I'll agree. That is not to say there aren't other alternatives that could one day lead to a likeness of the model he wants. ... maybe better and more lucrative. Keeping his name in the public eye has monetary potential that outweighs staying in the shadows and taking odd consulting jobs. Have you ever noticed that once a hit TV show is cancelled, the actresses and actors quit getting as many movie offers?.... but when their show is airing... they are swamped with movie deals? It's because movie studios want free advertising and a TV celebrity on the air every week is a good ad for their movie. My feeling is that Jim needs to keep his name out there even if it's a free donation here or there. Jim needs his work to earn attention again. If people are compelled by his writing, they will ignore any negative hype. That's just my opinion. Defiant1 |
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Post by Defiant1 on Dec 14, 2004 19:37:08 GMT -5
fun pillows pillows of love BAMs (big ass mammories) hooters titties heavy hangers juggs boobies boobs ok ok... I digress, BACK ON TOPIC MEN !!! Are you REALLY talking about healthy lungs? Defiant1 |
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Post by knightt on Dec 14, 2004 20:52:06 GMT -5
As a matter of fact... I am.  |
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Post by knightt on Dec 14, 2004 20:52:47 GMT -5
Last thing I heard was that he had some doings with the Phobos website... anyone have any resolution on that story ?
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Post by Defiant1 on Dec 15, 2004 1:43:11 GMT -5
Last thing I heard was that he had some doings with the Phobos website... anyone have any resolution on that story ? I think he's just consulting. That usually pays decent and requires a lot of bouncing around. My personality shifts towards a steady gig, not floating. There's just no telling unless he tells. If I did know what he was working on, it's not my place to say it f he's keeping t low key. Defiant1 |
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Post by knightt on Dec 15, 2004 21:26:14 GMT -5
Last thing that he wrote to me was that he was doing screen treatments, but I dont really know how that pays the bills.
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Post by frankaugur on Dec 15, 2004 22:02:28 GMT -5
Last thing that he wrote to me was that he was doing screen treatments, but I dont really know how that pays the bills.  |
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Post by Defiant1 on Dec 15, 2004 23:56:25 GMT -5
Last thing that he wrote to me was that he was doing screen treatments, but I dont really know how that pays the bills. I was conversing with a Defiant Comics inker and he was saying a lot of the creators from Defiant were able to get a job in Hollywood because of having Jim's name on their resume. Kind of ironic. Defiant1 |
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